生活在监控时代
【翻译】FLEDENCE 【校对】半个地球外的醌
视频仅供交流参考 禁止用作任何盈利行为
有许多电视剧是关于 There are lots of shows on television about
预防和解决犯罪的 crime solving and crime prevention.
但我从没有读过这样的一个剧本 But I've never read a script
迈克 爱默生 饰演哈罗德 芬奇
从这样特殊的角度切入 where people came at it from exactly this angle.
我觉得这样的一个 有些科幻色彩的故事是很有意思的 I think it's a really interesting meeting of a kind of science fiction
尤其是它现在并不是科幻故事了 而是现实发生的事 that really isn't science fiction anymore. It's actually fact now.
这个故事以科幻开场 却最终成为了现实 The show starts as fiction and it ends up as fact.
最开始当我们在决定切入点 讨论这个项目时 It was important when we were initially pitching and talking about the project
乔纳森 诺兰 执行制片人
很重要的一点是 要确保它尽量真实 并且要让人们意识到 to ground it as much as possible, and try to explain to people
这部剧的制作 是基于大量研究调查 no, this is really rooted in a lot of research
和大量现实中所发生的事之上的 and a lot of real stuff that's happening.
这不是遥远的将来才会发生的事 This is not 15 minutes in the future.
这是即将或者说正在发生的事 This is sort of 5 minutes in the future.
机器吗 机器无处不在 The machine? The machine is everywhere.
上万双眼睛在监视着我们 Watching us with 10,000 eyes.
上亿只耳朵在监听着我们 Listening with a million ears.
我认为在这种剧情里 I think in terms of, like, action and drama and, uh...
托尼 卡梅里诺 技术顾问
我们可以增添一些虚构 We can get away with some fiction.
但这种监控状态现在已经成为现实 But the idea of a surveillance state that's already here is fact.
这是政府的监控数据吗 Is this the government feeds?
直接来自米德堡的国家安全局 Direct from NSA at Fort Meade.
每个人的电邮 每通电话 监控摄像头 That's every e-mail, every phone call, surveillance cameras...
-全国范围内吗 -不 只是纽约 - In the country? - No, that's just New York.
我想说的是 这部剧真的很棒 I mean, it's a brilliant show.
它向你展示了科技能做到哪一步 And it shows where technology will take you,
安 卡沃克安博士 加拿大 安大略省 隐私专员
这也是为什么它如此引人入胜 and that's why it was intriguing to watch, because
每个人都在说 "我的天哪 everyone's saying, "Oh, my god,
他们能做到这个 他们也能做到那个" they can do that, they can do this."
他们所谈论的生物特征识别技术 例如人脸识别 The biometrics that they talk about, the facial recognition...
再与数据分析相结合 是非常有力的工具 ...combined with data analytics, absolutely very, very powerful tools
它可以分析出大量的数据 that will reveal an inordinate amount of information,
极度庞大的数据流将会在那样的系统中通过 massive amounts of information will flow, through systems like that.
我从基础的开始 教它如何通过手机定位 I'm starting with basics here, trying to teach it to track people,
以及人脸识别来追踪人群 using cell phone location data, facial recognition.
我基本已经准备好去解决下一个问题了 I'm almost ready to move on to the next problem.
-下一个问题是什么 -把他们进行划分 - What's the next problem? - Sorting them all out.
对于我们这些身处科技时代的人来说 非常重要的一点就是 It's always important for those of us in the technology world...
约翰 维拉森诺 加州大学洛杉矶分校 布鲁金斯学会 高级研究员
要跳出科技本身 理解科技能做到哪一步 ...to look beyond the technology itself, and understand what it enables.
在过去的5到15年中 And some of the changes that have happened
所发生的一些在信息层面的变革 in the last five or ten, fifteen years...
是非常令人瞩目的 ...are really stunning in the sense of the level of information...
信息现在可以被储存 移动以及分析 ...that can now be stored, moved and analyzed.
这总的来说是一件好事 但它同时也激起了一些关注 And that's generally a really good thing, but it also has some consequences...
考虑到监控以及追踪方面 ...with respect to surveillance and tracking that do raise some concerns.
现在的科技 已经走在法律的前面了 The technology now, it's ahead of the laws.
没人知道这会变成什么样 Nobody can see what, what this will be.
吉姆 卡维泽 饰演约翰 里瑟
我是说 那可能是乔治·奥威尔《1984》的加强版 I mean it's, it's George Orwell on steroids,1984.
现在到处都是监控 I mean, they've got surveillance everywhere now.
你在摄像头之下
相机 Camera.
这真的是伟大的发明 It's extraordinary.
史塔西可能会为了这种技术杀人 The Stasi would have killed for this technology.
如今 监控在美国人的生活中 已经非常常见了 Video surveillance is very common today in American life.
凯瑟琳 克伦普 美国公民自由协会 专职律师
我住在纽约市 I live in New York City...
你想要避开无处不在的监控 走完一条街 ...and it's hard to walk down a single street...
都是非常难的 ...without having movements picked up on surveillance cameras everywhere.
译注 ACLU 即American Civil Liberties Union
我们讨论过美国公民自由协会所做的一项调查 We talked about this ACLU research we had done...
格雷格 普拉格曼 执行制片人
他们试图来计量纽约市的摄像头数量 ...where they were sort of counting the number of cameras in New York City,
但这真的是 突然间 根本数不过来 and that became, all of a sudden, uncountable.
当你站在纽约街角 And while you're standing on a street corner in New York,
四处张望时 and you start to look around...
你会看到摄像头 之后又是另一个摄像头 ...and you see the camera, and then you see another camera.
当你从曼哈顿的一端开车到另一端时 You could drive from one end of Manhattan to the other...
可能只有短短几分钟 ...and there wouldn't be more than a couple of minutes...
凯文 查普曼 饰演莱奈尔 弗斯科
是不处于监控中的 ...where you're not under surveillance of some sort.
塔拉吉 P. 汉森 饰演乔斯 卡特
我会想 "那是一个摄像头吗 天哪到处都是摄像头" I'm like, "Is that a camera? God cameras are everywhere."
而确实是这样 And they really are.
你甚至都不知道 I mean, you don't-- you have no idea,
你走在街头 每经过一台ATM机 you walking down the street, every time you pass an ATM machine...
那里都会有一个摄像头 监视着你 ...that's a camera watching you.
所以当你决定做坏事时 可千万要小心 So you better be careful when you decide to do dirt.
外面所有的那些摄像头 All the video cameras that are out there,
杰伊 斯坦利 美国公民自由协会 高级政策分析师
不只是录下我们 not only are just, you know, videotaping us.
它们也知道我们是谁 But they're also knowing who we are.
一旦我们将这些摄像头联系在一起 And we put all those cameras together...
它就能追踪你去过的所有地方 ...suddenly, it can track everywhere you're going.
某些人可以在电脑上对你进行搜索 Somebody could do, like, a computer search on you,
调出城里所有拍到你的视频 and call up every video that's ever been taken of you by every camera in the city.
监听
你的手机会泄露你的位置 Your cell phone reveals your location.
只要是开机的就行 甚至都不需要你打电话 Whenever it's turned on, you don't have to be making a call.
如果是开机且联网的 网络会知道你在哪 If it's on and it's connected to the network, the network knows where you are,
而且越来越精确 精确到以米而不是千米计了 with increasing precision, you know, yards, not, not miles.
那就意味着我们每天的活动轨迹 That means that our movements throughout the day
都在被追踪 并记录在某个地方 are being tracked and recorded somewhere.
我们打电话给谁 谁打电话给我们 Who we call, who calls us.
你太偏执了 Finch You're paranoid, Finch.
理由充分 With good reason.
它们不仅能被用来实时追踪你 Not only can they be used to track you in real time,
手机公司还会保留你之前去过哪里的记录 but cell phone companies keep records of where you've been in the past.
政府会频繁地调取这些记录 And the government frequently accesses those records.
你几乎能在每一集都见到的最基本的一件事就是 One of the most basic things that you see in almost every episode,
就是我们通过蓝牙黑进手机 is where we bluejack a phone,
或者是我们将两部手机连接起来 or we are able to connect two phones together,
然后通过一部手机就能够听到看到 be able to hear and see everything that happens
发生在另一部手机上的所有事情 on one phone through another.
现在这是一项非常有用的技术 And that's an extremely useful technology today.
警探 你作证时描述得过头了 Detective, you went a little off script in your testimony.
它是个麦克风 经常性的 也是照相机 GPS定位器 It is a microphone, frequently, a camera and a GPS device,
还是社交工具 网页浏览器 and a social-networking device and a browsing device.
一旦你拿到了一个人的手机 你就什么都知道了 I mean, if you got someone's phone, you got the whole damn thing.
你的车
我刚刚锁定了这辆灰色货车的车牌 I've just flagged the gray van's license plate.
只要它再出现 车牌读取器就会向我们报警 So the plate reader will alert us just as soon as it appears again.
一件看起来马上就要成为系统性的 One thing that is really looking like it's quickly becoming a system
大规模美国人追踪系统 是车牌扫描器 sort of mass tracking of Americans, is license plate scanners.
只要你有照相机 就可以开始扫描 And this is where you have a camera and it scans a scene.
它会识别任何看起来像是车牌号的东西 It identifies anything that looks like a license plate number,
并自动对车牌号码进行读取 automatically reads the license plate number.
它会将车牌号与警察的数据库进行比对 It runs it against police databases
查找是否有违章记录 或是任何这类问题 to see if there's an outstanding ticket or anything like that.
我的意思是 这没关系 这确保了那不是一辆偷来的车 I mean, that's fine, you know, it makes sure it's not a stolen car.
警方会将他们每一个检测到的 What the police are doing is that they're retaining the data
车牌的数据存储起来 for every license plate that they see.
所以尽管他们检测到你我的车牌 这没有什么关系 So even if they see your license plate or mine, there's no problem with it,
他们会记下来你这个时候在这里 they're still noting you were at this corner at this time,
那个时候在那里 this corner at this time.
永久记录
近三十年来我们见证的非凡的科技进步之一 One of the incredible technology changes that we've seen in the last 30 years,
就是存储成本的大幅下降 is this plummeting cost in storage.
人们究竟在购买 How much it actually costs
数字信息存储服务上花费了多少 to buy the storage to store digital information.
告诉你一个数字 自从80年代中期 And give you some numbers, that's gone down
这已经降低了超过100万美元 by more than a factor of 1 million since the mid-1980s.
18Mb硬盘!
10MB硬盘
在80年代中期 1G的存储空间 In the mid-1980s, it cost roughly 85 to $100,000
大约要花费8.5-10万美元 to buy 1 gigabyte of storage.
而现在 已经降到了大约5美分 And that cost is down to roughly 5 cents today.
所以如果想要储存一个人在一年内 So to store everything that any one person says on the telephone
所有的通话记录 只需要花费17美分 over the course of a full year, only costs about 17 cents of storage.
我想说的是 总是会有不同的手段来追踪我们 对吧 I mean, look, there's always different ways of tracking us, right?
你在上网时会被追踪 你在开车出门时会被追踪 You can be tracked on the Internet, you can be tracked in your car as you drive around.
基于你信用卡的消费记录 You can be tracked with what you buy in the stores
也可以追踪到你在商店买了什么东西 based on your credit cards.
但真正的问题在于 所有的这些 But the real problem comes when all this information
来自你不同生活片段的信息 被收集到一起 联系了起来 from parts of your life is brought together and combined.
2002年11月 这从时间上看并不是最早的一次 November 2002. This isn't the first item chronologically,
但这一次引发了更多的注意 but it's the one that triggered a harder look.
-加油站收据 -是18张收据 - A gas-station receipt? - Eighteen of them.
都来自马里兰州陶森市外的加油站 From a shell station just outside Towson, Maryland.
数据处理
人们会说 "这就是个号码罢了 People say, "It was just a number.
它并不指向个人 它不具备个人识别能力" 这真是无稽之谈 It doesn't point to an individual. It's not personally identifiable." Nonsense.
这就是为什么我喜欢这部剧 That's why I love watching the show.
它展示了 你只要有 It shows the ease with which a piece of,
一点点模糊的数据 就可以轻松获得一份行为侧写 obscure piece of data can reveal a profile of behavior
并且联系到其他个体和活动 and links to other individuals and activities,
你可能从没想过这是可行的 that you would never have dreamed was possible.
所有这些信息的综合 The aggregation of all of those things
细致地展现出了我们是怎样的一个人 really paints a very detailed portrait of who we are,
我们的兴趣是什么 我们关心什么 我们在哪里工作 and what our interests are, what our concerns are, where we work,
我们的好恶 我们喜欢吃什么 还有等等一系列的事 what we do and don't like, what kinds of food we like to eat and so on.
现在的体系是 And the ecosystem
总的来说是商业体系 不是政府体系 really largely the commercial ecosystem, not the government,
在数据整合方面正变得越来越高效 is getting very efficient at aggregating all of this data together.
监视者
私人广告公司正在构建一个庞大的体系 The private advertising industry is building a giant machinery right now
来追踪每一个人做的每一件事 for basically tracking everything that all of us are doing,
弄清楚我们是谁 我们对什么感兴趣 figuring out who we are, what we're interested in,
我们正在想什么 what we're thinking about.
他们一整个的商业模型 Their whole business model
是构建在弄清我们想要什么的基础之上的 is based on figuring out what you want,
之后他们会在你面前弹出广告 and putting a banner ad in front of you.
那种你真的会点进去的广告 The kind of banner ad you're gonna click on.
事实上 这两个问题是完全一样的 The two problems are actually exactly the same.
没有什么不同 There's no difference.
你今天想在商店买点什么 What you're gonna buy at the store today is not really any different
与你今天想杀掉谁 或者说你打算干什么 than who are you going to kill today, or what are you scheming up, or,
没有什么区别 是一样的 本质上 他们是想要读懂你的想法 you know, it's the same. They're trying to read your mind essentially.
隐私问题一直都存在 There have always been privacy problems,
那些公司 还有政府 他们都想要你的个人信息 you know, companies, government, seeking your private information.
但在911之后 这一问题变得愈发严重 But after 911, it really became turbo-charged.
在袭击之后 政府赋予了自己权力 After the attacks, the government gave itself the power
来读取每一封邮件 监听每一通电话 to read every e-mail, listen to every cell phone.
人们想要被保护 The public wanted to be protected.
他们只是不想知道是怎样被保护的 They just didn't wanna know how they were being protected.
恐怖袭击确实不常发生 It's true that terrorism doesn't happen very often,
但从那些试图阻止这些事件发生的人 but it is also important I think to put ourselves
的角度来看问题 也是十分重要的 in the shoes of the people who are trying to prevent it.
而且 每十亿人可能只有一人是恐怖分子 And, you know, one in a billion people is maybe gonna be a terrorist,
但你需要分辨出那个人 这可不轻松 but you've gotta try to find that person, and there's no easy, no easy way to do that.
这是非常困难的 That's very hard.
大海捞针确实是一项非常难的任务 Finding the needle in a haystack is indeed, an extremely difficult task.
用这些技术就想得到那样的预测能力 And using these kind of technologies for that kind of predictive power,
是不可能的 it's not gonna happen.
你需要运用原先的手段 回到现实 You need old-fashioned boots on the ground,
亲身来做前人所进行的那种情报工作 actually doing the kind of intelligence work people used to do in the olden days.
-这是由爆炸造成的 -没错 - It was caused by a blow. - Yeah.
她在起火的时候是没有意识的 She was unconscious when the fire was set.
信息收集有时会超负荷 没错 Information-gathering could be an overload, correct.
詹姆斯 戴佛 军事顾问
而且 你会开始忘记你真正要找的是什么 Also, you start losing what you're really looking for.
这就是为什么你需要一位专家 And that's why you have to have the experts exactly
精确地指出你要寻找的东西 并把其它的东西都推到一边 to pinpoint exactly what are you looking for, moving all the other stuff away.
但这绝对不会是最终结果 But it's never gonna be, I think, you know, the final thing.
你永远不可能完全替代人类特工 You're never gonna be able to completely remove the human operator
在情报循环中的位置 from the intelligence cycle.
而且 我认为这样做 And, I think, to do so
也会带来一些道德伦理上的问题 would also take out an ethical or moral level or step or filter
我认为这是非常重要的 that I think is extremely important.
更好还是更坏
我们做过什么 去过哪里的所有数据都在某个地方留有存档 All the data about what we do and where we've been is archived somewhere.
某些人可能会在一件事发生后 And it's always possible for someone to decide after the fact
回过头来查 to go back and say:
"你在2011年5月7号在哪 都干了什么" "Hey, where were you on May 7th, 2011, and what did you do?"
而这会导致大量细节的重构 And that could be reconstructed to a stunning amount of detail.
这种情况在执法机构是常有的事 不是吗 It almost feels inevitable when it comes to law enforcement, doesn't it?
如果你能得到那样的工具 I mean, it feels like if that tool is available to you
通过它你可以打击犯罪或者预见犯罪的发生 in order that you can combat crime or you could see it coming,
那管它合不合法 为什么不试试呢 why would you not try to use it whether it was legal or not?
监视美国公民是非法的 当然是非法的 It's illegal to spy on American citizens. Well, of course it is.
但如果其中一个美国人卷入了 But what if one of your American citizens was involved in something
危及成千上万人性命的事件 又该怎么办呢 that was, you know, possibly detrimental to, to thousands of lives.
如果没有人看见机器检测到的东西 那理论上来讲 If no human sees what the machine sees, then, technically.
没有人第四修正案的隐私权被侵犯 no one's Fourth Amendment rights have been violated.
英格拉姆先生 你为什么不专注于你的电脑 Why don't you just focus on your computer, Mr. Ingram,
把宪法修正案问题留给我们呢 and leave the constitutional concerns to us?
因为我也是美国公民 Because I'm a citizen too.
而我更愿意让机器监视我的一举一动 And I'm a lot more comfortable having this machine watch my every move,
而不是你这种人 than someone like you.
这是这部剧最核心的问题 It's the central conundrum of the show.
为了每一周剧情的展开 And for the sake of storytelling week to week.
我们不会总是提出这种核心前沿的 引人深思的问题 we don't always have that kind of introspective question, front and center,
但我认为 季与季之间 还是要有这种问题 这种讨论 but I think, season to season, that question, that argument,
对于我们这部剧来说 是有关 which, really, in, in the terms of our show, is an argument
机器的存在方式 以及它是否应该存在的讨论 about the existence of the machine and whether it should exist or not.
老实说 我也没有好的答案 And honestly, I don't have good answers.
我的意思是 这个问题的答案是非常复杂的 I mean, I think the answer is complicated.
另外 法律制定方是否能跟上变化的速度 I think what's a little frightening is the capacity of lawmakers
也是有点令人恐慌的 to keep up with the change.
很明显 他们完全没跟上 It's, clearly, they're totally outgunned.
生活在信息时代
隐私和安全可以兼得 You can have privacy and security.
隐私和商业利益也可以兼得 You can have privacy and business interest.
我们与执法部门合作 We work with law enforcement,
不是来阻止他们既有的计划 not to prevent what law enforcement is intending to achieve,
而是为他们加上一些限制因素 让他们尊重隐私 but put some parameters around it, so that privacy can also be respected.
我们所生活的世界必须是多元的 This has to be a multifaceted world that we live in,
而我们所创造的体系也要基于这一问题 and the design of the systems we create have to address that.
作为消费者的你们 也需要在这方面进行一些思考 You, as the customer, also have to start thinking a little more.
隐私条款
基本没有人会花时间来看这些冗长的隐私条款 Very few of us actually bother to read those lengthy privacy policies,
隐私条款
我们只会点击或按下"我同意" 接受这些条款 that we all accept by just clicking or pressing "I agree."
如果你看了这些 你会震惊于 And if you read those, you often would be shocked
你拱手让出的权利 at what you're consenting to give away.
所以第一步是 要有意识地保护自己 So one place to start is to be demanding on our own.
人们的社交图谱 他们之间的关系 People's social graph, their associations.
政府花了这么多年来调查 The government have been trying to figure it out for years.
结果大多数人反倒乐意自愿给出 Turns out most people were happy to volunteer it.
我觉得人们总的想法就是 I think the general consensus of much of the public
"我不想知道这些 is "I don't wanna know,
你只要保护我就行" 但同时他们也在放弃一些权利 as long as you protect me." But then there are also things you give up.
你在网上浏览了些什么 And, you know, what, what things do you watch on the Internet,
这是你自己家里的私事 you in your privacy of your home,
谁在浏览 谁真正知道你干了些什么 who is watching that, who really knows what you have,
如果有一天 你不想公之于众的事情 and what's gonna happen one day when things that you don't want out there
被泄露出去了呢 现在没人想要思考这个问题 are going to be out there? Nobody wants to ask that question right now.
等到过段时间后 比如5年之后 You have a feeling like somewhere down the line, like five years,
会有很多人后悔 there's gonna be a lot of regrets.
但我们觉得将其作为这部剧的基石 But we think it's a really interesting bedrock
是很有意思的 就像是"我们掌握着这些信息 from which to form the show and say, "Well, let's just take this information.
将其视为给定条件 Let's play it as a given.
就这么播出 看看人们会不会开始思考 质疑这些" And then let's play out stories there and see if people start to question that."
那些监视的元素 You know, that surveillance element,
我觉得我从来没在电视上看过类似的 I don't think I've ever seen anything like that on television.
这也是将这部剧与其他警匪片 That's another thing that separates this show
区别开来的另外一点 from any other cop show.
这也暴露了许多问题 And it leaves a lot to be questioned.
它真的会启发你思考 就像是"哇 这真是... It really makes you think. And you say, "Wow, that..."
"这真的快成为现实了吗 Like, "Is that really that far off?
这有现实依据吗 这是正在发生的吗" Is there really a sense of truth to this? Is it happening right now?"
它也会让你环视四周 And it really makes you kind of look at your surroundings,
审视当下 and kind of look at today's society and say:
"已经到这一步了吗 "Well, are we really here?
我们和这部剧之间的距离已经这么近了吗" Are we really that close to this?"
你确定你真的想知道 Are you really sure you wanna know?
我们生活在信息时代 这听起来已经是陈词滥调了 We're living in the information age, and that sounds very dry and banal.
但事实是 But the reality is,
一旦那些数据被用来针对我们 the possibilities for what happens when that data begins to turn on us,
或者是递归开始起作用 if you will, or when the recursion kicks in,
那些数据能够自我分类 and the data begins to be able to sort through itself.
这时信息时代就开始有意思了 That's when the information age gets really interesting.
这也是这部剧 在所有事物之下 And that's what the show, underneath everything else,
在我们建构的故事之下 and underneath the story we structure,
在犯罪类型单元剧的层面之外 我们想要传达的东西 and the crime procedural aspect of it.
这就是我们在这部剧中想要反映的问题 Those are the questions that we're playing with on this show.
鸣谢